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Jalandhar, Punjab: Strained ties between Sikhs and the Ravidasia community, following murder of Sant Rama Nand in Vienna got accentuated with alleged removal of Guru Granth Sahib ji Birs by certain Dalits from gurdwaras named after Guru Ravidas in the Doaba region.
The Doaba region which witnessed widespread violence after the death of Sant Rama Nand has the largest population (about 45 per cent) of Dalits in Punjab.
Akal Takht Jathedar Giani Gurbachan Singh has asserted the Sikhs would not allow any such development to take place. “The leaders of a faction of Ravidasias are coming to meet and discuss the matter tomorrow. We are not going to allow any such deviation to take place. Minor differences can be sorted out through dialogue. Both communities have old ties, which should remain intact. Not only this, we are also going to call leaders of Udasi and Nirmala sects to iron out differences or misunderstandings, if any,” said Giani Gurbachan Singh. He, however, said he was not aware about the alleged removal of Birs from gurdwaras of Guru Ravidas.
“Ravidasias are anguished over what had happened in Vienna and afterwards. A section of them have even removed Birs from 100 gurdwaras named after Guru Ravidas in Hoshiarpur, Jalandhar and Nawanshahr districts in Doaba. While certain Dalits are supporting the move, we are not in favour of this as it is a matter of religious faith and understanding between the two communities. It is only for this feeling we have sought time from Akal Takht Jathedar for discussion on the issue. We are all for peace in Punjab,” said Gian Chand, a leader of Ravidasias and head of the Samaj Bachao Morcha, adding he had a list of gurdwaras from where Birs have been removed.
“We will give this list to the Jathedar. Our delegation is meet the Jathedar at Akal Takht at 4 pm on Friday. Besides, we are also holding discussions with 10 religious leaders of the Dalit community on the issue,” said Gian Chand.
He also confirmed a large number of Ravidasia families had started adhering to the recitation of just 40 shalokas of Guru Ravidas in place of the recitation of the paath of Guru Granth Sahib. “In fact, Ravidasias are too hurt over the Sant Rama Nand’s killing,” he added.
“We are also going to probe the removal of Birs from Guru Ravidas gurdwaras in Doaba,” he said.
Dar All, Sat Sri Akal. Wat has happened is mere lack of teachings of Guru Granth Sahebjee. Politically move can be taken the way politicians want to create disharmony. It is high time that we realise this fact and get the thrust of acquiring knowledge of Guru Granth Sahebjee truly. Once we acquire this then all fight over the world shall get over.
Respected Jaspinder singh ji, Sat Sri Akal, I have read your views. First of all i want to say that including me we have no right to say that we are Sikhs of Guru Nanak Sahib jot to Guru Gobind Singh and Guru Garanth Sahib because we pertend to be Sikhs or Singhs but we are not following the teachings of GURU SAHIBAN. From the core of my heart i am saying this truth. Secondly It is a great sacrifice of Guru Gobind Singh je that they have not put their Bani in Garanth Sahib, They put only Bani of Guru Teg Bahadur JE in GGS Je and at the time of Their time of physical demise they said to sikh that in future they take guidence from GGS je. The sikhs has no need to show certificate to any one that Guru Gobind Singh je has not said this thing and GGS is mute in this aspect, I think you have not read Bani And Gurithas. Sikhism is based on social equality and Guru Sahban has taken only those parts of The writings of the Bhagats and Bhatts which were according Sikh Philosophy. Guru Sahiban has sacrificed their lives to justify Sikh Philosophy or Gurmat and after Guru Sahiban about three lakhs of Gursikhs has sacrificed their lives for the noble cause of Sikhism. Guru Sahiban has given to the ravidasias a new life of social equality but what one can if you want to sit in the feet of RSS or Anti sikh lobbies , you can do what you want, what the bani of Bhagat Ravidass je remain in GGS for ever. BUT one thing most important is that Sikhs can never tolerate the WRONG interpertion of GGS AND ANTI SIKH ACTIVTIES ON THE NAME SIKHISM. Sikhism based on SHABAD GURU SURAT DHUN CHELA. IN SIKHISM GYAN ( KNOWLEDGE ) IS GURU NOT ANY PERSON.
SIR I WANT TO ANSWER BOTH SIKHS & DALITS .FIRST SIKHS,MY FRIEND WHO HAVE HARD CORNER ABOUT HOW TO RESPECT SRI GURU GRANTH SAHIB JI MAHARAJ,REQUIRED TO CHANGE THERE ATTITUDE.SRI GURU GRANTH SAHIB JI IS NOT ONLY GURU OF SIKHBUT OF ALL DALITS(RAVIDASSIA),NIRMALES,SINDHIS,ALL LIVING&NON LIVING THING ALSO,GURU OF ALL ANIMALS,PLANTS,I CAN SAY GURU OF ALL UNIVERSE.EVERY ONE SHOW THIER RESPECT WITH THIER OWN MANNER.ALL UNIVERSE HAILS SRI GURU GRANTH SAHIB JI.WE SHOULD ALL RESPECT THE OTHERS RESPECTS.MESAGE OF GURU GRANTH GRANTH SAHIB JI IS FOR ALL,NOT ONLY TO JAT OR FOR RAVIDASSIA.NO ONE SHOULD TRY TO LIMITISE THE GURBANI.RESPECT GIVEN TO SRI GURU GRANTH SAHIB JI IS BEYOND THE LIMIT & THERE IS NO LIMIT.DHAN DHAN SAHIB SRI GURU GRANTH SAHIBJI .
NOW TO MY RAVIDASSIA FRIENDS,WHEN A SIKH COME FOR PRAYERTO GURUDWARA WITH A FOLDED HAND TO TAKE A BLESSING OF HIS GURU.WHEN HE HAIL(MATHA TAKNE) TO SGGSJI IT GOES TO ALL GURUS,BHAGATS,BHATTS,SIKHS,MAHAPURUSHS,SAHIDS.I CAN NOT DIFFERENT IN THAT.ALL ARE IN ONE.IF U DONT RESPECT SGGSJI THAT MEANS U DISHONOURD BHAGAT RAVI DAS JI ALSO.IF U LOVE RAVIDASS JI MAHARAJ THEN LOVE SSGGSJI.U MAY BE DALITS(RAVIDASSIA)FOR A REAL SIKH U ARE ONLY HIS SIKH BROTHER.
(2)HAVE A DEEP WATH TO YOUR COMMINITY, SOME BECOMES CHRISTIAN(SAAEE),SOME TRY TO MAKE U ALL BUDDIST,SOME OF U ARTE STILL HINDUS.IF U CALLED URSELF RAVIDASSIA THEN U ARE NOT OTHER THEN A SIKH.ONE SIKH CAN NEVER DISHONOURD HIS GURU
It is a matter of worry and great concern that such types of news are coming. Gurmat and Gurbani are a global concept. It is a concept of social equality, physical perfactness and purity of mind.Guru Nanak Dev je has preached this and collected the sacred writings of great saints or bhagats from diffirent parts of indian sub continent.The communities to which these bhagats belong were badly discarded by hindus and they have to live lives bad than animals and they belong to both hindu and muslim communities. Fivth Guru Arjan Dev ji composed all bani in ADD GARANTH AND PANTH IN WHICH ALL HAVE EQUAL STATUS AND EQUAL RIGHTS. Till from that time upto now, there were hidden efforts to break this union and to destroy philosophy of social equality, physical perfactness and purity of mind and to give a heavy set back to this third panth and its NIARAPAN. There is no diffirence between Bani and Guru. The enemies of this third panth and Guru Garanth always wanted to show the Dalits to their right place in varan asaram. If we played in their hands, we will fall in the same well from where Guru Nanak Sahib taken us. My request to all that we should not go away that union and the world of social equality.
WGDK WGDF,if someone who say that”i m the guru here,throw the other one from my place”is totely black minded person,nd we all know that what is going on,dhan bhgat ravidas g,have see all this before,they see us now from the other world,nd they have’nt pain to see like this,than guru arjun dev ji gatherd all bhagts and the 10th king gives a superior position to SGGS,they down himself to respect of guru’s nd bhagts(SGGS),and they also do this in respect of bhagt ravidas g,so dnt get in the matter of castes etc,live nd make other people live. Tbcnt..
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Dear Harry Singh and other friends:
Jai Gurudev.
First of all Guru Gobind Singh didn’t say “Guru Granth ji manoe, Shabad guran ki deh…” nor does this couplet appears in SGGS. This couplet dates back to period after Guru Gobind Sing’s demise. Also SGGS is mute about its own Guru status. It however talks about having a guru. Even if Guru Gobind Singh bestowed guru status to SGGS, he did it for sikhs, not for ravidassis, etc. We as Ravidassis, consider Bani as a guru. The paper it is written on whether it is paper of SGGS or an ordinary newspaper for that matter, is not guru. If bani is guru then how can a book made of papers on which bani is written can be a guru. For a moment if we follow this logic, does it imply SGGS downloaded from internet and printed on my printer is also a guru and I should wrap it in reams and reams of clothes and keep it in AC room ?
Having said that, as a tradition if we have respected so far a granth as a guru. Again it is out of tradition and not because we consider it as a living guru. Since Sikhs themselves claim that we can’t respect (or we don’t know how to respect SGGS), it is better for us to get rid of it. This is a peaceful solution for Ravidassis and Sikhs. We value human life and decency over any book. Our respect for bani will remain forever while for the book, it is directly proportional to the respect sikhs have for our Saints.
We, as ravidassis, value life over books. Sikhs so dearly quote out of bani but forget in a moment that it is “bani” they should be listening to and following, rather than kill others because of the medium it is written on. But then why should we bother explaining others and trying to make them understand our viewpoint?. We have gotten rid of this ritual of worshipping/mattha teking books for good. This is like getting rid of final form of slavery which was forced upon us and took us away from the message while forcing us to ritualism that gurus tried so dearly to get rid of.
You can ask people to move mountains, if you shower love but if you show your aurangzeb type attitude then hell with it. As a Punjabi couplet goes “Bhala hoya larh nereyon chuteya, umar na beeti sari”. Thank god, we have gotten rid of it and our whole life is not wasted. For Bani however, whether it is of Guru Nanak, Guru Angad Dev Ji, Guru Amar Dass Ji, Guru Arjan Dev ji and all bhagats, we will keep it our heart forever.
People should be free to choose if they want Guru Granth Sahib in their gurudwara, Akal Takt should not dictate otherwise. If a person doesn’t want to believe or follow Sri Granth Sahib then that person should not have it, well, it is his loss, let them remove Guru Granth Sahib.
Guru Gobind Singh united all different castes, and their are people who still want to remain separate then let it be. Furthermore, I don’t even have to mention this; even known Sikhs (majority) still follow the caste system such as Jat, Ramgarhia etc so what these folk can tell others or how could they make other people follow. If you don’t believe me then trying marrying your son or daughter into opposite caste and you would know. Recommendation, first learn yourself and follow then others would and stop hypocrisy.
We will keep on stray,disturb, desperate,arguing , fighting and thirsty until unless we will look for Guru in human body and based ourselves according to caste difference. The Shabad inside Guru was real Guru and they had transferred and merged into text form in SGGS with the banis of Bhagats. Guru Gobind Singh ordered us “GURU MANIYON GRANTH” and we must not look elsewhere and beyond this words by 10th king. We cannot alter the SGGS.
May Waheguru provide GURMAT to those “MANMUKHi’s” who are always stand in, try to sacrilege the supreme position of SGGS and create division in our religion.
baanee guroo guroo hai baanee vich baanee anmrith saarae ||
The Word, the Bani is Guru, and Guru is the Bani. Within the Bani, the Ambrosial Nectar is contained.
gur baanee kehai saevak jan maanai parathakh guroo nisathaarae ||5||
If His humble servant believes, and acts according to the Words of the Guru’s Bani, then the Guru, in person, emancipates him. ||5||
Gurfathe
Dhan Dhan Bhagat Baba Sri Ravidas Ji. Dhan Dhan Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji. We highly respect the bani. Whether it is Bhagat Ravidas Ji’s.